So this is neat. Potentially life changing for some type 2 diabetics, but that depends because some t2 diabetics are not failing to make enough insulin, they’re just no longer sensitive to it at a level that makes it functional for them. I suppose it’s possible that this therapy could cause them to grow enough islet β cells to overcome their lack of sensitivity, but (and I’m a type 1, not a type 2, so maybe my info is incorrect here) that lack of sensitivity can grow with further exposure to insulin making this a stop-gap at best for those cases absent other therapies.
…and with all of that said, being able to regrow islet β cells has never really been the problem for type 1 diabetes. You can regrow all the islet β cells you’d like and it’s not going to cure the underlying immune disease that has caused your immune system to kill off all of your islet β cells to begin with. Unless you can figure out why t1 diabetes causes one’s own immune system to go psycho killer on their islet β cells, you’ve done nothing to “cure” diabetes. Without being able to suppress that impulse for your immune system to murder your own cells, any ability to replace the islet β cells is going to be temporary at best, and probably a waste on the whole.
My brother in law is a “cured” type 1 diabetic, by virtue of his having had a kidney replacement and being on immune suppressing drugs for that. Since they were already replacing the kidney and he was going to have to take immune system suppression medications for that, they also just replaced his pancreas at the same time and the suppression of his immune system has allowed the new pancreas to thrive and continue to make insulin. Easy-peasy. The only trade-off is that he is super immunocompromised and can be killed by common colds, so not a great strategy in general.
And it will be provided for free to anyone who needs it, right? Right?
Only outside USA.
Hey, don’t forget Yemen, South Africa, Nigeria, Egypt, Pakistan, Iran, and Sudan!
A fine group to belong to, we can all agree.
You have to agree to pay a 2000$/year subscription for Life™ after taking this medicine.
So, taxes?
In China, possibly. In the US, not before there is a revolution. In France, not after years in Parliament and seeing 3 to 5 physicians
Banned for national security
Free + $46,000 in Ch-China tariffs.
Certainly not in the US of A… but the rest of the world may have a chance if this actually pans out
In Cuba, yes. Capitalist country? Maybe no
Most capitalist countries still have universal heath care…
Are you including the periphery in that statement?
The what?
The periphery. Basic term if you’ve read anything serious on capitalism and how it functions in the world.
Right. So what does it mean?
Countries within the capitalist system which are underdeveloped through violence and coercion in order to be able to extract a higher surplus value extraction to constant capital ratio for capitalists is the gist of it.
Please let me know if there are any terms or concepts I should break down further. (Earnest)
It’s sad to see USA so shackled by pure capitalism that it starts to lose its scientific edge left and right while drooling libs jerk off to the big pharma freedom of unrestrained gains. Still believing they have a chance for the piece of the cake if only they squeeze their cheeks a little harder.
👏 👏 👏
I am super confused by your take here. Liberals who, and let’s be clear, regularly push for better if not universal health care (and are the only major party to do so) jerk off big Pharma to you? How exactly do you get to that conclusion?
They might mean neo libs.
It’s fucking annoying when capitalists keep coming up with capitalist positions and naming them so that they sound like they are something else. Like neo liberalism or libertarianism, which are pretty close to the same thing (all about a deregulated, private, free market), only libertarians like to emphasize how they are ok with sex and drugs.
Liberals want governments and collective public elements to protect the rights and freedoms of individuals (from other individuals, organizations, and governments).
Neo liberals want governments and collective public elements to stay out of their affairs and let them manage their own interests.
Liberals want governments and collective public elements to protect the rights and freedoms of individuals (from other individuals, organizations, and governments).
If the overarching “freedoms of individuals” is the freedom to exploit the labor of individuals then yes, that’s the core of liberalism.
If by “collective public elements” you meant collectivizing the means of production, then no, that’s socialism/anarchism/other.
That’s the core of neo liberalism. Liberalism has a “my rights end where yours begin” component but neo liberalism drops that and expects the free market to solve such conflicts.
And by “collective public elements”, I meant public organizations like the postal service, police departments, etc. The government itself is supposed to be one of those. Liberalism is neutral on what is and isn’t collectivized. Neo liberalism likes privatization but appreciates that some functions are better handled by the public, like law enforcement and road maintenance. Libertarianism believes it should all be private.
In the last comment I said neo liberalism and libertarianism are pretty much the same, but it’s more accurate to say libertarianism is an extreme version of neo liberalism.
Liberal = laissez faire
Liberals means different things around the world. Here it means free markets circlejerkers, Adam smith cultists, invisible hand of the market preachers while at the same time anti lgbt for some reason. Pro freedom but anti freedom. Full of paradoxes. Neonazi too and even conservative despite based around free market peddling.
After all we live in a post truth word where even people who agree with each other cannot communicate anymore due to shifting meaning of the words thanks to the politicians and media.
How can we even converse if the words itself are stolen, changed and used for war? Do we need to use mathematics instead of language if the latter is disfigured beyond recognition? Changed into a tool of some demagogue?
Adam Smith had a completely different definition of “free markets” than Neoliberals did.
You just said that liberals are hardcore capitalists despite the fact that liberals are the ones pushing for a hybrid socialist democracy where key industries are socialized so that rampant corruption, which is an effect of the invisible hand, can be avoided. You go on to say that liberal means conservative.
Phrases like ‘we are living in a post truth world’ are a self fulfilling prophecy for those who use that phrase… for the rest of us you just sound like a far-right provocateur.
It appears you are either very confused or you are a dishonest interlocutor and are completely full of shit.
Lmao sounds like you got some stick up your ass. Go get some qualified help with pulling it out
Careful, your ad hominem is showing
Damn I am trying to stay classy today despite all odds. I may need to kill someone (in a game) before the day comes to an end to release that steam from hormone inbalances
Fuck it I am going out to the city, to my city
Maybe you should try putting a stick in your ass
“Liberal” isn’t only a word used for US progressives. “Liberal” is used to mean someone who believes in “free-market” capitalism, private ownership of the means of production and anti-nationalization, anti-protectionism/anti-regulationism, and individualism/anti-collectivism. It’s pretty much synonymous with right-wing “libertarian” ideologies, including neoliberalism, classical liberalism, and "anarcho"capitalism. This is what the word has always referred to normally, and is by far the most common usage in most of the world, and it’s still used this way in the US – mainly in economic, philisophical, or “fundamental rights” contexts though.
Liberalism is pretty much the antithesis of socialism, in a purely left-versus-right sense at least.
Modern American liberalism is democratic socialism and that’s what it has meant since FDR…
"In the United States, liberalism is associated with the welfare-state policies of the New Deal programme of the Democratic administration of Pres. Franklin D. Roosevelt, whereas in Europe it is more commonly associated with a commitment to limited governmentand laissez-faire economic policies."Consequently, the ideas of individualism and laissez-faire economics previously associated with classical liberalism are key components of modern American conservatism and movement conservatism, and became the basis for the emerging school of modern American libertarian thought.
This doesn’t mean that liberalism = conservatism.
Surely you must notice that “Modern American Liberalism” and “Liberalism” are two separate terms? “Liberal” can mean MANY things other than American liberalism. It even specifies in the article you’re quoting. You cannot just assume that any and every usage of the term “liberal” is in reference to social liberalism, even in America it’s still used in the common/typical/“original” sense frequently (just not by uninformed voters).
And AFAIK nobody said anything about liberalism (and American liberalism) and conservativism being equivalent either. “Conservative” is a significantly more broad term than “liberal” and it’s impossible to definitively equate or oppose them, but generally conservativism is opposite to progressivism – seeing how liberalism is usually socially progressive, it isn’t generally a perfect match. But there does exist “conservative liberalism”, which is socially conservative and economically liberal – in theory what American conservatives are supposed to be, but in reality they’re a bit more… fascist.
Relatively though, American liberals are significantly more conservative than, say, socialists and most leftist ideologies. They still hold many very (especially fiscally) conservative beliefs. There are plenty of American liberals that are in the pockets of big pharma.
Also calling modern American liberalism “socialism”, even “democratic socialism”, is laughable. Socialism requires abolishing capitalism and having the means of production belong to the workers/public. Democratic socialism is an ideology that believes that socialism can be achieved through peaceful democratic reform rather than violent revolution. Modern American liberalism specifically advocates for a mixed economy with mostly private, but some nationalized, industries, which is very much NOT socialist. It is quite literally, regulated capitalism. It also specifies that in the same article you quoted. You can’t just take any welfare state (or attempt at one) and call it socialism.
For the most part, “lib” is synonymous with “so-called market capitalist and liberty advocate”, i.e. almost all Americans in politics. A non-American using it to describe American politicians bought out by big pharma makes perfect sense.
.world user try not to be confused about the word ‘liberal’ challenge (impossible)
This is a really insightful argument you have proposed. am going to have to give it a lot of thought because it’s so sophisticated and well thought out/communicated. You should be proud of yourself.
Liberals don’t do that, progressives do. Liberals say that universal health care is too complicated and nuanced so we better just stick with the system we have because that’s generating profits so it must be working.
Why is everyone online so incredulous of this breakthrough? Is it just Sinophobia or are there reasons to doubt Chinese medical findings?
Because in the past we’ve seen a number of similar headlines that never became reality, so people are naturally skeptical.
Their Covid vaxx was trash. My aunt’s friend was a UAE resident, and got sinovac Covid shot. He later caught and died from covid, so that’s my anecdotal reason not to trust it, but if it is true, this would be a great thing.
you’re an idiot if you’re basing assumption that on your dead aunt.
You’re an idiot if you can’t read a whole 2 sentences and grasp any sort of reading comprehension.
There’s reason to doubt all sensationalist medical headlines
But this is 1 patient, no long term effects studied (just doesn’t need insulin injections), and hasn’t been validated
Nothing to do with China
Oh crap! If this is true then avoid spending a ton of money in insulin supplies each year could give an actual reason to politicians for reducing the healthcare state budget, which they normally do at every occasion just without a proper explanation… I don’t know if my mind is ready for rationality in politics /s
Hm, 5 year old journal, with the editor board, funding and half of the authors all from the Chinese Academy of Sciences, but significant hospital contribution. I remain skeptical of the headline but hopeful of the science.
Well if it’s real, it will be a no brainer Nobel prize, so it certainly won’t be the last we hear of it in that case.
strong competition with the teeth regrowing guy
but i think diabetes is more important than missing teeth lol
I mean even though the CAS is a state organization of China, they do still put out real science. they have real researchers working with and for them. I’m honestly more concerned about what they don’t put out than what they do.
For sure, I just get antsy when peer review doesn’t come from from external sources
As you should. I think thats an important part of the process.
I do hope that the science is true, but the website doesn’t seem to be credible when it comes to news reporting https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/the-economic-times/
theres a lot of other places reporting on this, and a scientific paper in nature. https://www.abc.net.au/news/2024-01-02/breakthrough-in-diabetes-treatment-research/103278156
presses X to Doubt
Type 2, since the article doesn’t say.
It’s actually for both types according to the articles in Nature
Yeah but the person “cured” had type 2.
There might be applications for type 1, but that’s speculation.
The articles suggest that it may be beneficial for Type 1, but that’s unconfirmed. The nature of early-stage clinical trials is that people don’t really know how things will work. That’s the point of the trials.
Isn’t type 2 the one that effects massively more people?
Iirc type 2 is acquired diabetes, type 1 is the one you get from birth, so yes.
A lot of people actually don’t get diabetes type 1 when they are born but later in life
Important to know. Reading on how it works on the article, I wonder if it could be used for type 1, likely in combination with some kind of drug therapy to prevent the body from just killing the new islet cells.
New trade restrictions coming soon on Chinese pharmaceuticals.
True. How could it be a free market if corporations are not allowed to form a cartel and agree on a price for a product that is literally vital for many people?
yeahhhh we’ll see about that
What are the odds we’ll get this in America in the next 20 years? Or that insurance will cover it? I mean we live in for-profit medical hell. They actually have weight loss drugs that like 7/10ths of Americans need, but a month’s worth cost over $1,000 out of pocket. Insulin is already stupidly overpriced and there’s no financial incentive to cure it, so why would they? The insurance and pharma companies aren’t in the business of helping people. If they were there be non-proffits (for a start). Instead they get as much federal subsidy money as possible and then still charge $1,000 a month that insurance might cover if you’re lucky or rich enough to even have any that’s worth a damn.
So yeah, cool story, but here in America this won’t make any difference. Maybe in 50 years it’ll be affordable, we’ll see.
Weird how the MBFC comments are being deleted
Citing MBFC without supporting evidence is lazy and actively harms discussion in favour of policing “wrongspeak”. I respect it.
If this were true, I wouldn’t be finding out about it on Lemmy
To be fair, not much of a demand for such a permanent cure in leading profit driven health care systems where diabetes medicine is gold. How about MSN? https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/other/world-s-first-diabetes-cure-with-cell-therapy-achieved-in-china/ar-BB1n7cNA
Though one does well to be skeptical yet.
Right? Media and science do not play well together. I can’t count the times I’ve seen amazing new discoveries or cures heralded by the media that never come to fruition because they were only ever just theoretical to begin with or they were never replicated by any other researcher.
Lemmy is a news aggregator. Why wouldn’t you find out about an early-stage clinical trial on Lemmy?
Any such treatment, even if it works, would take decades to pass through the various approval stages before being released to the public.
The headline isn’t ’early stage clinical trial starts the multi-decade process of developing a cure for diabetes’… the headline reads ‘diabetes has been cured’
Alls I’m saying is that if the headline as written were true, we would be hearing it from all news sources at once, not just some single post on a somewhat obscure news aggregator.
Maybe you should be reading Cell Discovery, then
How would reading Cell Discovery increase my chances of hearing about a cure to one of the world’s most pervasive afflictions on some obscure Lemmy post, and more puzzling, how would reading Cell Discovery make it more likely that some wild medical claim with far reaching implications would both be true and also absent from every other news source? What kind of magic does this Cell Discovery have?
That study, which is admittedly a bit above my pay grade, says that more study is needed. It doesn’t say that diabetes has been cured, which is the headline that media outlets have chosen.
My only point was that if diabetes was actually cured, everyone would know about it, not just you and me.
If this were true you wouldn’t hear from this at all.
A permanent cure isn’t something that is wanted by pharma companies. It’s better for them to have something that keeps patients alive and that they need regularly and that is expensive but cheap enough for them to get.
Pharma wants that sweet IaaS platform. Insulin-as-a-service.
But why wouldn’t a rival company just start up and sell the cures? Not all pharma companies sell insulin.
Because then the rival company would also go out of business. The pharma industry is not about absolute cure but about continuously selling things - like all industries do. Medicine that cures you entirely and is not needed afterwards forever again is nothing the pharma industry wants.
Exactly, that’s why we’ll never have a vaccine for something like polio, it’s too profitable to make and sell iron lungs.
We have a vaccine. Not a cure.
You joke, but that’s actually a really interesting story. Jonas Salk, the developer of the first polio vaccine was adamantly against even patenting it and claimed that it ‘belonged to the people’. There is some potential controversy there, but we mostly just think he was a pretty great dude. Dude’s a fucking hero regardless.
I get the analogy you’re trying to make, but maybe want to switch to something else.
I get the analogy you’re trying to make, but maybe want to switch to something else.
Like any other vaccine?
I don’t really see how that goes against it. If anything it shows that some people will totally disregard profit in favor of bettering humanity. See also: the patent for insulin.
Just as a heads up, this source has failed fact checks.
Imagine using dailymail as a reason for why news are factual.
Citing MBFC without a supporting claim that discredits the article is lazy and does not benefit the discussion. Comment removed.