It seems like every shower has its own unique way of controlling water temperature and pressure. Of all the showers I’ve ever used, no two of which have ever been alike, I like my controls the least. Plus the faucet has started dripping lately.
Is this likely to be something I can replace on my own, without a plumber? To me, that means: Can I likely do this without damaging the wall, without having to mess with pipes, and without needing to do anything involving words like “hacksaw”, “weld”, or “plumbing torch”?
Basically I believe in my ability to buy a faucet and control thingie from Home Depot; to use screwdrivers, allen wrenches, pliers, and regular wrenches; to use things like plumbing tape, lubricants, and caulk; and to remember to turn the water off to the house.
Would a project like this likely require anything more complex than that? I tend to prefer shower controls that have separate knobs for hot and cold, but I figure going from a one-knob setup to a two-knob setup is definitely going to require reconfiguring the plumbing. Should sticking with a one-knob solution be okay?
I don’t know if it matters but I live in Florida in the US, and this place was built in the 1980s. I doubt this matters, but my current controls work by turning the larger knob left or right for temperature, and the smaller knob for pressure.
My place does have some annoyances - like the front door is an uncommon size that’s difficult to find replacements for at places like Home Depot. Is there any chance of me running into issues like that when it comes to things like the size of the pipe openings?
Thanks for any insight.
Edit: Thanks for all the replies. It’s pretty clear now that this is something that could very easily end up a lot more involved and time consuming and property damaging than I’m comfortable with.
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This comment sums it up pretty much, also depends where the hot and cold water supply connects to the valve behind the tiles you might need to remove more tiles around it or make the cavity for the valve bigger to re-route the pipes. Some concealed valves have the connection points on the sides, some on the bottom, etc. Also they can be different size from the current one. Best case scenario of you can access it from the other side of the wall, that makes things probably a bit easier and less mess in the bathroom.
Good news is once you remove the old valve you can fit pretty much any type of valve: thermostatic or manual mixer depending on what you are looking for.
I would definitely not call it an easy DIY project, but everything is doable.
Thank you for the detailed response.
Is there any way I could accomplish part of my goal without getting into the complex work you described? For example, what if I left the controls alone but tried to replace just the faucet, for the drip issue? Or if I were able to locate the exact same controls, would it still require all of that work to replace them? I ask that question because the pressure knob is slightly broken, after being overtightened in an attempt to slow the drip. I’m concerned it may eventually break more completely.
The drip is the reason of the valve failure. It can be a limescale issue or just simply an old valve. Whatever part is controlling the waterflow (control unit, cartridge, etc) can be replaced if its still available.
Contract the manufacturer for spare parts advice and they should also have instructions on how to replace it.
If you have the same thermostat control, it should be (relatively) easy. You probably don’t need to swap the faucet. It’s dripping because of the thermostat.
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The leak got a lot worse pretty suddenly - so it’s now leaking something like a few gallons an hour I’d guess (Though water is the one utility we don’t pay for here, so it’s annoying but not world-endingly urgent). So I decided it was time to get around to this - but when I got to the point in the images, which is right after the escutcheon you mentioned, I was no longer certain how to proceed.Based on the images, is this still a relatively simple job that I can do with one or two trips to Home Depot? I don’t really know what I’m looking at here - do I grab the white part with pliers and yank it out (Or twist if it’s threaded)? If so, is the rest of your advice still relevant - take the seals to Home Depot and look for as close a match as I can, since I looked and looked and couldn’t find a manufacturer’s name?As of right now I’ve re-assembled it and turned the water back on. I did get a look at the pipes at least and they seem to be copper. There’s drywall behind the pipes that I would absolutely be willing to let a plumber tear into to avoid tile work. If I did end up calling a plumber, and nothing went wrong, do you happen to know the general ballpark of what it may cost?Also, sorry. I know I’m asking for a lot of information and advice here. If you’re not up for another round of free advice I’d totally get it.I went ahead despite the uncertainty and it all seems to have worked out. Instead of finding replacement seals I replaced the entire cartridge - I was able to find what was a pretty-much-exact match. The only problem I had is the set screw for the escutcheon wouldn’t keep it tight anymore - but I found another that worked. The old cartridge was so loose that I thought the new one was subtly the wrong size when it offered a large amount of resistance going in - because the old one would slide in and out with no resistance whatsoever.
Thanks for the help - your comments in this thread more than any other went above and beyond.
Thats amazing. You ran into some type 2 fun and figured it out on the fly. I kinda hate plumbing for that reason. Seems like you touch it and 12 other things go wonky. I forget if I mentioned replacing the cartridge potentially. Some have a cartridge, some have seals some have both. But yea, good work, appreciate the update.
Real talk OP: From your post and comments it’s pretty clear that you don’t have much plumbing experience. There are a lot of things that can go wrong with replacing a shower valve.
If this is your main bath, this is not the job to learn on. Especially if you don’t have any shutoff valves between your main and the shower. If you run into something unexpected during the repair, and you’d be stuck with all your water shut off while you wait for a plumber, and then you’re also paying emergency rates.
As it is now, you have all the time in the world to consult plumbers and compare estimates. With your water shut off and your shower broken, your options will shrink really fast.
If getting into home improvement is something you’re interested in, and this is a spare bathroom you can afford to be out of commission for an indefinite period, and it won’t require your main valve to be shut off, then by all means give it a try. But expect there to be surprises and fuckups as part of the learning process.
I’m someone who used my main (only) shower/bath to learn this stuff on. My wife happened to be 8.5 months pregnant. Don’t be me.
I got it done, it works, it doesn’t leak, it looks how I want. But it was stressful AS FUCK, and my extremely pregnant wife was showering at the YMCA for almost a week while I was dicking around with this stuff (we re-tiled the whole tub surround, including replacing all the drywall with cement board, reinsulating, vapor barrier, etc). Like…I don’t regret doing it because we had tiles falling off and it needed to be done. And I’m glad I learned all the things I learned.
But it was not easy, I ran into tons of shit I was not prepared to handle and had to figure out on the fly, and it was very time sensitive and stressful. I might have chosen to start earlier if given another chance lol.
I will say, one of the first things I did was install shutoffs on both supply lines right below the faucet. That was a very good choice because at least the rest of the house wasn’t down.
So this is an old Mixet shower valve. You can try ordering the parts for a rebuild and changing the cartridge for it, but in my experience the valve body has issues with it. We usually end up replacing them with either a Delta or Moen single handle shower valve.
Source: Plumber for 13 years.
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Hehe. I remember when the maintenence dude who claimed to know plumbing came and said “we don’t need to turn off the water valve to replace that faucet” and started work. I was on the phone to the super in a minute complaining that that idiot was about to flood my apartment. Then he did. Idiot didn’t get fired somehow.
Same idiot dropped an oven three stories onto my neighbor’s car. Somehow that didn’t get him fired either. I don’t now how he had that job.
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So there are definitely two things I don’t fuck with and I’ll call a professional for it.
Plumbing and electrical.
You can learn to do these things yourself but unless you’ve decided to fully commit yourself to these crafts you’re just better off hiring someone.
This kind of shower controls are the best. I had this on my shower but right now my place is gutted for a remodel. I really want to get the same exact kind that you have. It’s super convenient because you set the temperature once and then adjust the pressure separately. You don’t have to constantly tune it to the right temperature with every shower.
I had a contractor replace an older faucet a few years ago. He opened up the wall and found older, very brittle plastic pipes, I don’t remember what exactly but they are not modern PVC. He was able to replace the faucet and fix the leak that precipitated the visit, but was emphatic that further leaks and issues were likely.
With an older fixture like that, after learning this, I wouldn’t touch it.
My home was built in the late 90’s.
an older fixture like that…My home was built in the late 90’s.
Somehow I don’t think you meant 1890’s. As someone born in 1954, it’s really hard to realize that things which were built long after I became an adult are, nonetheless, now considered “older”. sigh
I was born in 1982 and am turning 41 shortly, starting to feel out of touch and cringey myself.
Also I have teenage kids and you could easily be one of my parents. How’s that for a blow? 😁
I’m not very handy, but I learn when I need to.
For reference, I replaced the belt in my dryer last night. It took me 3 hours, I had to look up a few videos, I cut up my hand, and had a few “extra” screws at the end. But, the dryer works!
I’ve replaced the knobs and spout on my shower, and it wasn’t hard at all. You just pull them off, and pop on the new ones. If you are trying to change anything about the pipes behind that, I’d call someone.
If you fiddle with anything electrical turn off the breaker/remove the fuse and wear protection, anything plumbing turn the shutoff valve and ensure the tap runs dry.
If you are:
- close to a well-stocked plumbing supply store you will make a few trips to *willing to potentially go a long weekend without a working shower and water
- ready to call a plumber anyway after trying if you fuck something up
- just wanting to replace with a compatible cartridge (which may not be easy to find/identify, and replacment options might be uglier), for anything at/behind the wall just call the plumber
- wanting to spend a few hours reading guides and watching 360p video tutorials
Then I say give it a shot.
Go on google or Amazon and search for shower valves, you’ll find pictures of what’s inside the wall behind the chrome plate you got there… seeing images will give you a better idea of what to expect than anything anyone can describe.
After that, go take the knob off your shower valve (probably the center cap pries out, you take out a screw, and it pulls off), then take off that chrome ring (Allen screw on bottom, or it might just get pried off carefully or unscrew the whole thing, they vary). Have a look… that’ll tell you what your specific type of valve is and if you can do this without making a big ass hole in a wall…
Then figure out what’s on the other side of the wall the valve is on… if it’s a closet, maybe a big ass hole in the wall is ok? A big ass hole in the wall of the shower will involve tile. I’m thinking based on your description that you should 100% not fuck with tile. You’ll get into all manner of special tools, special skills, etc. real quick with tile :) a hole in drywall in someone’s closet might be a homeowner kinda deal though tbh.
Those three things are hopefully enough to answer your own questions, because the real “no bullshit” answer is that it depends… pex, copper, iron, delta, thermo, yadda yadda yadda… The shit inside the wall is as varied as the shit on the outside…
I could do this myself, but I wouldn’t… sink, toilet, ice maker, leak in the crawlspace, move the hose bib outside to the complete other side of the house, replace the water heater, add an expandion tank, all that shit is an immediate “fuck no im not paying soneone to do that, ill do it”, but a shower valve is a hard no :)
Have a look by all means, no harm in checking it out, but I wouldn’t be too optimistic in your shoes.
I won’t mess with plumbing again after trying to replace my kitchen faucet only to discover that the shutoff was old and busted the moment I turned the knob, leading to water spraying out everywhere. Called in a plumber to fix it and it took him several hours to resolve–no chance I had the knowledge, skills, and tools to fix that.
Every plumbing project no matter how small has resulted in me having to turn the water off to most or all of my house for 3 to 6 hours…
I just always seem to hit random unexpected things. So if you’re willing to spend the entire day working on it, make 2 trips back to the hardware store after your initial purchase and family can go without water for a half a day, go for it! Otherwise call a plumber, they will have anything they possibly need in their truck and will be done before you go back to the hardware store the second time.
Oh and make sure your comfortable soldering, just in case… It’s not difficult, but for some reason it scares people.
Do you know where your water main turnoff is?
Do you know a local plumbing supply you can buy from instead of Home Depot? I’ll never buy a faucet from HD.
I do - I’ve used it a few times. The most involved plumbing I’ve done is installing a bidet, and installing a garbage disposal, though. From all the other comments it seems like this has the potential to get significantly more involved.
Yeah it’ll be a progression from there but watch a few YouTube videos for examples and you’ll figure it out.
Very likely yes, there is a YouTube channel called This Old House they have many videos on home maintenance by experienced people.
A YouTube channel called This Old House
I remember when it was Bob Vila and Norm Abrams on PBS. Glad to see they’ve made the digital transition.
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It’s not a Moen, it’s a Mixet. I am not a fan of rebuilds or cartridge change outs on these. It’s doable but usually the valve body has something wrong with it. Usually just change them out with a delta or a Moen single handle.
To fix the leak and possibly replace the handle if you’re interested check this video. It may not feature your exact model but it will give you an idea of what you’re in for. I did this myself on both of our bathrooms at our old house with no issues.
https://youtu.be/MkPcCmYkG4Q?si=_VryQ6uZmwpj3lom
As far as reconfiguring the type of mixing etc… others have explained it pretty well. to me it would be a definite “call a plumber moment.”
